Trapped in Islamic Wonderland

A certain Muslim responded to my post Islam in Wonderland on Facebook and we had a back and forth exchange there. Unfortunately, he blocked me before I could reply to his last message.

Abdulmalik: I have read your thoughts about Islam in wonderland. I must say their is no myth and fairly tales in the koran, neither is there is any contradiction. What you refuse to to acknowledge is the deep meaning of what each of the verse represent.

Surah 6:14 “Say: shall i take as a guardian any other than Allah, the creator of the heavens and the earth and it is He who feed but is not fed. Say: verily, i am commanded to be the first of those who submit. And be not you of the idolators.” What it means is that, at that very moment in time he was the first to believe in the revelation and submit to Allah. Same thing apply to Q6vs163. It does not mean that he was the first mankind to submit to Allah…

Q7v: 143: “And when Moses came at our appointed time and his Lord spoke to him, he said: My Lord!! show me (thyself), so that i may look upon thee. He said: you cannot (bear to) see Me but look at the mountain, if it remain firm in its place, then will you see Me; but when his Lord manifested His glory to the mountain He made it crumble and Moses fell down in a swoon; then when he recovered, he said: Glory be to thee, i turn to thee, and i am the first of the believers.”

In this verse which you refuse to quote is what transpire between Moses (may peace be upon him) and God when he went to receive the criterion. He ask to see the Lord, but was told will not be able to see the Lord in this world, when God manifested his glory the mountain crumble, and Moses exclaimed that he was the first to believe.

Islam means that one submit ones self to the creator, with associating partners in any form to Allah. A muslim is then is someone who submit his/herself to Allah, with associating partner to Him. All those who you mention that claim to believe in one God, then compare their doctrine of one God to the following simple quote from quran. “Say: He, God is one. God is He on Whom all depend. He begets not, nor is He begotten. And none is like unto him” Q112 vs 1-4.

Then compare The believes of Abraham, Noah, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses, Jesus (peace and blessing of God be upon them to those verse if it contradicts, and surely you will find no contradiction with these pious servants of God.

What then Mohammad (peace he upon him) did about qibla, when to fast, how to pray etc is to standardise the practices of Muslims and perfect the religion of God. What you succeeded in doing is to lie and deceive, that is why you do not quote fully from your source. I hope you upload my response on [your] blog.

Victor: I got your messages reading my mind (that I spend my time devising ways on how to “lie and deceive people”, that’s why I don’t quote fully from my sources. Thanks!) You must be the “champion scholar” bold enough to burst all my “lies”. So thanks once again.

My point in Sura 6:14 was that Muhammad admitted he was the first Muslim (“I am the first Moslem“). We have no problems with that. Every historian agrees with it, so I accept it. First means first in my language. Even if you say he was the first to “believe in the revelation and submit to Allah” I may not argue with you.

The Islamic worldview says everybody was busy worshipping idols, but one day an “angel” squeezed an Arab man in a cave, then suddenly he started continuing the religion of Abraham – a man who had died over 1,500 years before him, and that was a man who never even lived in Mecca! Such funny myths.

The problem started when Muhammad began to contradict himself by claiming Moses also said he is the “first of the believers/Muslim.” So which is it? Was Muhammad the first Muslim or not? How can there be two firsts? That was my point in the post, yet you toe-danced it away.

If you are familiar with your book, you would have known that some Egyptians became Muslims too (Sura 26:51), so which is it? Is Moses still “the first to believe?”

You said Islam means to submit oneself to the creator, and that all those people in the Bible believed in one God. I already refuted this lame definition.

Every religionist submits to a god. Sikhs submit to one God, are they Muslims? Jews submit to one God, are they Muslims? Satanists submit to one god, are they Muslims too?

That one believes in one God doesn’t make one a Muslim. It’s a shame you ignored this fact in my post. You are a poor advocate if you keep repeating a point that has already been refuted. Besides, you have not yet proven to me that the god of Islam is the Creator. That is blind belief. Prove this then we can discuss further.

You spoke about the “beliefs of Abraham, Noah, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses and Jesus.” Where did you get their beliefs from? Where are their Islamic books? All their words in the Quran are plain forgeries from Muhammad’s lips. Islam didn’t exist before Muhammad. Anybody who says otherwise is swimming in a myth.

Only Muslims believe their religion predates Muhammad. Please wake up from this delusion. If you want the real facts about these men, consult the Bible. They are not in Islam. I could care less about a jumbled mass of confused post-Christian Arabic writings from a warlord.

You speak so much about logic, yet on this point, you abandon logic and cling to the redaction of a 7th century Arabian liar.

I have already defined what a Muslim is in the article: one who adheres to the five pillars of Islam. None of the people before Muhammad knew of, let alone followed the five pillars, so if you tell me that they are Muslims, you are just rehashing your myths (tales) and if you persist in that, I will simply ignore your points. Why should I embrace Islamic myths and not Greek or Aztec myths?

You said Muhammad came to “standardize and perfect” the religion of God. What a joke. That means for more than 4,000 years, this “religion of God” had no standard and had no one to perfect it. So the hands of Allah were tied until the 7th century when Messiah-Muhammad came along. If this fantasy suits you, that’s cool, but don’t please don’t call it the truth.

Abdulmalik: Muhammad (peace be upon him) was the first to submit to the oneness of God when the revelation was revealed to him. He was the first at that time to believe in it, that is why he was able to call others to it.

Likewise Moses, for he was the first to believe at that moment, before he travel to Egypt to warn Pharoah and his people… They did not claim to be the first mankind to submit…Yes, [Islam] means submission to the creator. That is why I gave a basic description of what oneness of God is Q112vs1-4.

I ask you to compare those who you called to believe in one God if their God is as it was stated in those verses. All those which you mentioned have an image of God, and God said in Q112vs4 that “there is none like Him”. When you said and angel squeezed him into a cave to give him a message. Where did God spoke to Moses? Did he squeeze him to that place?

Where did angel met Mary to give her glad tidings of a pious son? Did he squeeze into that place?…You said Abraham never stayed or live in mecca? You only confirmed that you are just bent on decieving people, who then built the this black stone you refer to?

Victor: I have said I will only continue this exchange if you are forthright in answering my questions. If you ignore my questions after this, I will terminate further correspondence with you because I prioritize my time.

I will allow the issue of the “first Muslim” contradiction to rest, since you can’t address it.

You talked about Muhammad’s submission to one God, yet you refuse to answer a simple question, which God did he submit to? Wasn’t Allah one of the many pagan gods of Mecca?

Where is the proof that the deity Muhammad submitted to is the Creator? Or are you telling me that Allah is equivalent to the chief deity of any pagan culture? If that’s true, then Allah is equivalent to Vishnu, Baal, Jupiter or Osiris. Anyone can submit to just one pagan god and then become a Muslim right?

That is why your argument fails. You are concluding what you are yet to prove. You have accepted through blind belief that Allah MUST be the creator and you are trying to force your assertions on us. Sorry, it won’t work.

Muhammad’s father was Abdul-Allah (servant of Allah), his uncle was ObeidAllah. They were Allah worshippers, yet they weren’t Muslims but pagans! Allah was simply a pagan deity straight out of Arabian paganism. Read this

Since Islam didn’t exist before Muhammad, whatever “image” he had about Allah (whether physical or mental) must have come from somewhere. You can’t tell me that a 40 year old pagan all of a sudden received a “new image revelation” about the same deity worshipped by his fathers. This is why I find your quote from Sura 112:4 “there is none like him” amusing. Your Allah appeared to Muhammad physically (53:1-10), Allah has a face (55:26-27), a hand (48:10), an eye (20:36-39), a shin (68:42), and he even forgets (2:37) etc. So how can you say “there is nothing like him?” Read this for more

It seems you haven’t read the Sirat Rasulullah where it was recorded:

“…Gabriel brought him the command of God. ‘He came to me’ said the Apostle of God, ‘while I was asleep, with a coverlet of brocade whereon was some writing, and said, ‘Read!’ I said what shall I read? He pressed me with it so tightly that I thought it was death, then he let me go and said, ‘Read!’ I said ‘What shall I read?’ He pressed me with it again so that I thought it was death … He pressed me with it the third time…” (Ibn Ishaq, translated by Alfred Guillaume, p. 106)

How many people in the Bible were squeezed and forced by an angel of God? None! Only demons act like that. Yet on the basis of your own ignorance, you question the veracity of the experience of your guru. Keep it up!

As for the issue of hajj, Abraham, Mecca, Adam or Noah, I don’t wish to talk about them again because I sense you are incapable of breaking free from your lalaland. Since all your claims are based on just one fairy tale book – the Quran, you have no historical backing.

I’ve told you you are free to rehash your myths as much as you like, but don’t present them to me since I wont buy them.

Abdul Malik: If you claim islam have spread all those things you mentioned, why do people of different background accept this your so called “lies”, “myth”, “forgeries” etc, its because they see through all media lies that it portray in islam … I have done that critical analysis my friend, about moon-god, warlord, polytheist, pagan, i have read all those, but they always get it wrong like you. Apply the logic then my friend to what you believe.

Victor: You asked why islam has spread among many people of different backgrounds if it’s false, I’ll tell you why:

1. Lies are spiritual. Satan is the “father of lies” and he is the brain behind all false religions. Once he breathes into a lie, it lives on and spreads far. That is why religions founded on myths are still alive and kicking. They serve the devil’s purposes in enslaving mankind and keeping them from the Gospel.

2. Islam is not learnt naturally, it has to be imposed by brainwashing. From young ages, Islam is drilled into people by hammering the same ideas into their heads over and over again, and censoring any criticism of Islam. This is why Islamic nations ban the Bible and Christian materials. A lie that is often repeated often becomes “true” to those who refuse to think out of that precinct.

3. Islam appeals to the fallen human nature. It gives a false outward impression of humility and loyalty, whereas it approves of the worst vices inherent in man. It approves of hate, war, adultery, use of charms, deception, looting, rape and even paedophilia. It also promises a carnal heaven and an afterlife debauchery that would more or less appeal to criminals.

I’m sorry, you are incapable of doing any critical analysis of Islamic beliefs. You are a “submitter.” You may criticize other belief systems, but when it comes to Islam, your reason becomes a limp noodle.

This is called a blind spot – it’s just like a fish that doesn’t know it’s in water. You still don’t know the nature and extent of deception into which you have fallen. Ignorance can be very deadly. I simply pray your “applied logic” helps you find truth in Jesus Christ.

The Two Faces of Islam

Many years ago, Steve Emerson produced a documentary for PBS. The video was titled “Jihad in America.” Its cameras went directly inside cell groups associated with mosques where eager young Muslims were being actively recruited for jihad against the U.S.

It showed Muslim leaders making wicked statements about bringing America to its knees through terrorism. One of them said:

Blood must flow, there must be widows [and] orphans. Hands and limbs must be severed and limbs and blood must be spread everywhere in order that Allah’s religion stands on its feet.”

As I type this, this religion of Allah is stands menacingly over the corpses of thousands of Christians and remains of burnt church buildings in Northern Nigeria, Central Africa, Syria, Egypt, Pakistan and several other nations.

Blood has flowed. Widows and orphans have multiplied. Many have become sex slaves in the Muslim markets, while others are still nowhere to be found – and Allah is pleased.

Many modern Muslims have run all over the social space in desperation, quoting some “peaceful” verses from their Quran and trying hard to distance Islam from the insidious actions of Muslim terrorists all across the globe. But such efforts are futile.

Our facts about Islam are from its primary sources – the Quran, as well as Hadiths and biographies of Muhammad written by Islamic scholars. Muslims can only play up their ‘Islam is peace’ card by writing another Quran or scraping their Hadiths.

There were two phases of Muhammad’s mission – the Meccan and Medinan. There is a difference between the two which explains why Islam has “two faces” from one geographical location to another.

1. The Meccan phase: tolerance and peace when a minority

In Mecca, Muhammad had only a handful of followers. Majority of the Meccans were Pagans, Jews, Christians and Sabians, and they weren’t interested in Muhammad’s Islam. They laughed at his absurd claims and left him to his rants.

For a period of 10 years, he had just 100 followers. During this time, the Quranic verses he recited (supposedly from Allah) were tolerant and conciliatory towards the infidels:

Be patient with what they say” (Sura 73:10)

We know what the infidels say but you are not to compel them” (Sura 50:45)

If it had been thy Lord’s will, they would all have believed, all who are on earth! Wilt thou then compel man against their will to believe?” (Sura 49:11)

Lord, these are people who do not believe, ‘Bear with them and wish them peace. In the end, they shall know their folly” (Sura 43:88).

There was no call to war in Mecca because the Muslims were a minority and having been raised in a religiously heterogeneous culture, didn’t see the need to impose their ways of worship on others.

2. The Medinan phase: Offensive war when non-Muslims are outnumbered.

Muhammad left Mecca alleging that the infidels were scheming to kill him. This is very unlikely for reasons already stated. He finally resided in Medina. There, he gained more followers and was able to raise a large army to spread his novel religion. Then his Quranic recitations changed to violence and force:

“And kill them wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah (persecution) is worse than killing…” (Sura 2:191)

Strive against the unbelievers with great endeavour” (Sura 25:52)

“But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every strategem of war...” (Sura 9:5)

Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which has been forbidden by Allah…nor acknowledge the religion of truth from among the People of the Book [Jews and Christians], until they pay compensation [jizya] with willing submission…” (Sura 9:29)

The theological implication of these conflicting phases is this: the former (Meccan) verses of peace have been replaced or abrogated by the later (Medinan) verses.

The final commands of war takes priority over the initial verses of peace. According to Tafsir Ibn Kathir on Sura 9:5, 25

“These Ayat allowed fighting people unless, and until, they embrace Islam and implement its rulings and obligations … This honourable Ayah [9:5] was called the Ayah of the Sword, about which Ad-Dahhak bin Muzahim said, ‘it abrogated every agreement of peace between the Prophet and any idolater. Every treaty and every term’.” (Vol. 4, pp. 375-357).

Some Muslims rationalise Muhammad’s bloody wars by alleging that the pagans persecuted him when he was in Mecca, so he had no choice but to raid, kill and rape them.

But when one examines even biased Muslim records, it’s clear that Muhammad was the aggressor. He was the one who first started attacking and insulting the pagans and their deities, and they begged him to stop.

“When he [preached Islam to his tribesmen], they did not withdraw from him or reject him in anyway … until he spoke of their gods and denounced them. When he did this, they took exception to it and united in opposition and hostility to him…”

The Meccan leaders reported this to his uncle Abu Talib saying: “…Your nephew has reviled our gods, denounced our religion, derided our traditional values and told us our forefathers were misguided … Either curb his attacks on us or give us a free hand to deal with him” (The History of Al-Tabari: Muhammad at Mecca, Montgomery W. Watt and M. V. McDonald, 1988, Vol. VI, 93-95)

The Arabs prior to Muhammad lived together with Jews, Christians and were not bothered with whatever god Muhammad wanted to worship. All they asked for was for him to stop insulting their deities and ancestors.

Even when Muhammad persisted in his mockeries, they neither assassinated him nor his followers. Whereas Muhammad killed anyone who spoke against him or his religion when he attained military might.

Another implication of these two phases is that, it lays down a pattern of behaviour for Muslims for all time (After all Muhammad is their “perfect example” Sura 33:21).

When Muslims are a minority in a place, they preach peace and tolerance and clamour for rights they can’t give non-Muslims in an Islamic state. But once they gain an upper hand, they reveal the second face of Islam – wage war and impose Islam with force.

Ninth century Islamic scholar, Abu Tirmidhi declares:

“In normal conditions, when Muslims are in power and they are not living as a minority, and they are not under any compulsion or subjugation, it is an order for Muslims that they should not give such leeway to the non-Muslims and they should not greet them first nor yield the way for them” (Jami’ At-Tirmidhi, complied by Imam Hafiz, 2007, Vol. 3:19).

This “two faced” principle is also practically applied in Islamic deception or taqiyya/kitman.

Sura 3:28 says: “Let not the believers take disbelievers for their friends…whose doeth that hath no connection with Allah unless (it be) that ye guard yourselves against them taking (as it were) security. Allah biddeth you beware (only) of himself…”

The Tafsir al-Jalalayn comments that “unless you protect yourselves against them as a safe-guard (taqatan, ‘as a safeguard’, is the verbal noun from taqiyyatan), that is to say, [unless] you fear something, in which case you may show patronage to them through words, but not in your hearts. This was before the hegemony of Islam and [the dispensation] applies to any individual residing in a land with no say in it.”

That is to say, a Muslim is theologically permitted to lie and deceive non-Muslims, particularly when they are a minority. Ibn Kathir explains this verse too saying:

“In this case believers are allowed to show friendship to the unbelievers (outwardly) but never inwardly. For instance, Al-Bukhari recorded that Abu Ad-Darda said ‘We smile in the face of some people although our hearts curse them ‘ …The Tuqyah is allowed until the Day of Resurrection…”

So, Islamic jihad actually stands on two legs – deception and violence. The first makes way for the second.

Part of the taqiyya tricks Muslims love to play is when they selectively quote their Quran to try to portray Islam as a peaceful religion. They love to quote places like:

a) Sura 2:256 “There is no compulsion in religion…

Islamic scholars have given different explanations about the context of this verse, but they all agree that it has been abrogated or replaced.

Some of them explain that ir applies to the People of the Book (Jews and Christians) who can choose between the options of conversion to Islam and jizya in an Islamic state.

That passage was recited when the Jewish women of Ansari who had vowed to convert their sons to Judaism were among the Bani Nadir Jewish tribe expelled from Medina by Muslim warriors and Muhammad’s opinion was sought.

The Tafsir of Al-Qurtubi however, says: “‘No compulsion’ was abrogated and he [Muhammad] was commanded to fight against the People of the Book in Surat at-Tawba” (Classical Commentary of the Holy Quran, 660).

b) Sura 60:8 “God forbids you not with regard to those fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them…

First of all, the Meccans didn’t actually drive out the Muslims, it was Muhammad himself who demanded they migrate with him.

Second, the term “fight you” in Islam also refers to those who criticize or verbally attack Muhammad or Islam. This can be seen from verse 2 which says:

If they come on you, they will be enemies to you, and stretch against you their hands and their tongues to do you evil, and they wish that you may disbelieve.”

Sura 9:12 too says “But if they violate their oaths after their covenant and attack your religion with disapproval or criticism then fight (you) the leaders of disbelief (chiefs of Quraish- pagans of Makkah)…

Hence, to insult or criticize Muhammad or Islam (even by cartoons) is the same as “waging war against Islam” and the penalty of that is ostensibly death. This is how the cult of peace works. An Islamic scholar admits:

“As for those who cannot offer resistance or cannot fight, such as women, children, monks, old people, the blind, handicapped and the likes, they shall not be killed, unless they actually fight with words [e.g propaganda] or acts [like spying or assisting in warfare]. Some [jurists] are of the opinion that all of them may be killed…” (Sheikh Ahmad ibn Taymiyyah, The Religious and Moral Doctrine of Jihad, 28).

c) Sura 8:61 “But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace…

Tafsir ibn Abbas says: “This [verse] has been abrogated by the ‘sword verse’ [Sura 9:5]”.

Islamic scholar, Sheikh Yusuf Azzam also says: “Jihad and the rifle alone. No negotiation, no conferences and no dialogues” because “if the fighting stops, the disbelievers will dominate and fitnah, which is Shirk (polytheism) will spread” (Join the Caravan, pp. 9, 20).

Another common Quranic verse quoted is Sura 5:32 which says killing one man is the same as killing the whole of mankind. That has been addressed here.

Until people understand that Islam has two faces, they will keep embracing its mild face where it’s still a minority as its true form, not realizing that it has a beastly face, a dark side, which we now see daily in many parts of the world and which its dawagandists cannot successfully hide.